27 PPG on 65 TS% over his last 2 seasons too :(
Straight up one of the best scorers in the league by his season 2nd season and we’re probably never gonna get to see his career actualized
I 100% get why New Orleans extended Zion, but holy hell that thing already looks like it's more likely than not to be an awful deal.
From the 23-24 to 27-28 seasons, they are scheduled to pay Zion around 200 million. He's electric when he plays, but at this stage, I have no idea how you can count on Zion to even average 41 games a year.
Forget the regular season. Even if they load manage him like crazy what are they gonna do in the playoffs where starters play extremely heavy minutes very often with little to no rest between games
No way NOLA makes the playoffs, they are 3-7 in their last 10, and in a 3 way tie for 10th now. Both Thunder and Blazers are playing better, they'll finish ahead of NOLA. The irony is that all season fans were laughing about getting the Lakers pick (via swap), but now NOLA is going to finsh with a worse record.
I agree that it's likely they fall out, but they can still get in.
They have the fourth-easiest schedule left for the remainder of the season. They have a stretch of consecutive games coming up against Houston (2x), San Antonio, and Charlotte. They are a much better home team than road team, and four of their last five are at home. Josh Richardson just got back and I think Nance and Alvarado will return for the home stretch.
Portland and OKC are both 4-6 in their last 10 so it's not like they're setting the world on fire, either. NOLA is in a bad spot, but they were last year, too, before winning 5 of their last 6.
It's crazy how we seem to tell fans every yr it's only been 20 games calm down whether it's a bad team getting off to a good start or a good team starting slow. The 1st 20 games can be weird as shit sometimes
You get him on a diet and have him drop 30/40 pounds. He may lose some of that strength, but I bet he even gains some of that explosiveness he had at Duke back, and I’m sure the injury concerns would be significantly reduced. It worked for Barkley back in the day, who was a similar size and player.
His style of play at his height and weight is just not sustainable for the human body. We had this fear before he entered the league, and it’s proven to be warranted. Gotta get the weight down and hope for the best.
KP focused on losing weight/prioritizing strength in the offseason after trying to bulk up in Dallas, and he's managed to play 55 games so far (inshallah he shall remain healthy). It's a legit strategy for longevity.
Yeah, idk if that was Dallas’ or KP’s call but it was a bad one. New York KP looked like a prime Dirk clone! Lanky, but very fluid and quick.
Then he gets to Dallas and looks like Ivan Drago. Problem is, he moved like him too. Super stiff, not coordinated, and not explosive at all on the offensive end.
Glad he’s seen some success with y’all!
Funny enough, I remember Chandler Parsons bragging about how much muscle he was packing on and Carlisle saying he should not do that because he’s going to hurt himself. And we all know how that went. Dudes gotta be very careful with the muscle they add on with how much running and jumping they have to do.
I’m no pro but it’s funny how I just went through the same thing. Got back into organized ball and was in the gym heavily and in the best shape of my life. But of course managed to pick up so many minor injuries and I thought it was me just getting older and breaking down. But I just had to cut back on the heavy lifting and focus on my fitness and my functional strength. Don’t look nearly as jacked which was a bummer at first, but feel better than ever when hooping which more than makes up for it
I started specializing in Olympic weightlifting after decades as a basketball then volleyball player.
I think I broke my knees the first volleyball game back after 3-4 years of weightlifting.
I dunno man, at some point the team is probably gonna have to address his weight. It seems like the whole issue has been handled with kid gloves since he entered the league. Like yeah, he lost weight but let's be honest he was still pretty big (evaluating by elite professional athlete standards of course).
Like I get that it's a tough conversation to have, especially in America it seems, but it seems pretty obvious to me that it is effecting his longevity, especially given his extremely physical/athletic play-style.
Same. Hard not to see it coming. Very disappointing as a fan of the sport.
I will say I did not foresee Ja’s current issues at all. Thought he was the safer pick of the two, but we’ll see how that goes.
Jonathan Isaac was the 6th pick in 2017, and Zion was the 1st pick in 2019. They've played 261 games combined.
Grant Williams was the 22nd pick in 2019 and he's played 273 games, not including playoffs
There were so many people, myself included, that saw this coming all the way back before he was even drafted. The guy is like 300 pounds and beats in his body like Derrick Rose. There's just no way he holds up.
LeBron also doesn’t try to play while being a good 30-50 lbs overweight though. His joints are going to age a lot better than Zion who is on track to have old man knees by the time he’s 35 if he doesn’t improve his conditioning
i see a lot of Bron's workouts also involve a lot of resistance and stability training on top of the usual strength routines. i think that plays a huge part in it as well. incorporating those into your regimen is important no matter how light or heavy you are, but especially for athletes because their joints take a lot of pounding.
The way Zion plays the first person I thought of was DRose if he was heavier and taller. There was no way I thought Zion would be healthy after seeing DRose fall apart. Being top heavy like that just accelerated whatever issues he has in his posterior chain.
Drafting Wemby at #1 is a have-to situation. I would rather my team be clowned for drafting Wemby and dealing with his injuries than passing on him in some Sam Bowie-type scenario.
True, and if the Spurs get #1 I have no doubt they'd have to take him, too. Though Scoot or even an underheralded player could end up being the best player this class, you just never know.
While it is scary, they have to draft him. One bright side is Wemby hasn’t gone through the AAU system and (as far as I’m aware) doesn’t have the wear and tear on his body that a lot of American prospects currently have.
that video of the guy clearing his jam before shooting that poor man again. i was like well that's probably off the beaten path. no, i scooted past that place on my way to city museum a few years back. i was only in stl for 2 days but i liked it.
The Mississippi-Missouri is, not just the Misssissippi. Important distinction as that branch (although named differently) goes all the way to Montana and not Minnesota
The Mississippi watershed spans roughly 1/3 of the total land area of the continental U.S. This river was a huge part of the U.S.’s economic success, especially before planes. New Orleans was like the 4th biggest city in the country around 1900 in part because the Mississippi port was so important
Also a big reason why St Louis was “The Gateway to the West” because it was near the confluence of the Mississippi and Missouri rivers with the Illinois River not too far from it. St Louis was also Top 5 and even held an Olympics in 1904.
Yep, the headwaters are located in Itasca State park, about a 4 hour drive north of the cities, up there the river is about 3 and half feet deep and like 12 feet across. It's a Minnesotan's right of passage to walk across the [rocks](https://img.apmcdn.org/7e09ea30950afb473c021b676e196bd15a54c09b/uncropped/591325-20200904-itasca-state-park06.jpg).
It takes 90 days from the water there to reach the Gulf of Mexico
If he could get his defense back to where it was last season I'd be happy with it
this season though it's been a step back for him for whatever reasons. last season he looked like he was going to become an above average defender
at the moment though absolutely nobody is scared of RJ guarding him and will shoot over him all day and catch him on any number of screens
I wonder if his jumper/release gets affected by eri tbh. Kinda like how Draymond looks like as if has a bag on him. Lmao,I am imagining mha characters as attachments to nba players now.
You see this a lot with WRs in football for basically the same reason.
They're just too explosive. The human body isn't really meant to do a lot of these things.
Zion has a whole biomechanical imbalance. You can see this just by his gait (the way he walks). Poor mechanics means your body won’t be able to dissipate forces on the body well and his added weight (increased weight + gravity = more force) is only going to contribute to added stress that’s going be placed on his body. It sucks because he’s such a freak of nature but I don’t think he has any real longevity in this league. We’re going to look back one day and think “damn that dude Zion could’ve been one of the all time greats if he could have sustained himself”.
That’s what I heard but promoting more efficient biomechanics is a lot harder than simply just rehabbing a muscle strain or fracture because it has a great deal to do with a person’s alignment, posture, and motor control. How Zion’s moving at the moment is most likely how he’s been moving his whole life so it doesn’t just happen within a few days or weeks. He needs a really good rehab specialist and his own ability to learn/retain these new motor patterns is a huge variable.
Yup. I’m relearning how to walk properly after a host of different foot related issues. Two years and countless PT hours later, I’m probably only halfway there. Granted I’m not working with world class trainers and therapists around the clock, but still, my PT is one of the best in the SF Bay Area and I’m focused on this to prevent further issues and complications down the road. There’s just so many complicating factors all you can really do is continue to go at it and hope for the best.
Appreciate it. It isn’t anything horrible, and if you saw me walking on the street, you wouldn’t even be able to tell. I was just trying to figure out why I kept rolling my ankle.
Lakers were #1 seed right before Bynum got hurt and before the Gasol trade. A huge part of that was how good Bynum was at 20 years old.
Bynum was a legit beast before his injury and probably well on his way to being the second or third best center in the league after Dwight and Yao.
As a Lakers fan, I will never forget the 08 season for many reasons. Expectations were #7 seed again but ended up as #1 seed. Bynum looking like a star. Return of Fisher. Kobe MVP season. Bynum got hurt. Gasol Trade. Getting to the Finals. And then I forgot what happened after that.
>before Bynum got hurt
Yeah that’s the point I’m making. He was always hurt because of a combination of the way his legs were oriented and his height/weight
He was already the second or third best center in the league at that point imho. Mostly because they weren't many great centers in the league during those years but still
He has very bad body mechanics. By that I mean, look how he walks. He is walking like a penguin. Remember when he was first out, you got news like zion needs to learn how to walk. He is very muscle bound + the weight, he is a walking injury.
Unless he loses weight and works on his body mechanics, adds flexibility to his joints he will never play a whole season. His work ethic is also not the best, I just don't see it.
Hard to say if it doesn’t have an effect on him due to being overweight, but it could just be that he has poor flexibility, muscle imbalances, bad posture, or a weak core. I’m 29, 6’1 175 and I consider myself in pretty good shape (still play sports and workout a lot). But I’ve been plagued by hamstring issues since I was 21. Pelicans should get him in some kinda offseason yoga program to help with soft tissue injuries.
As an older dude, I'd say you're right on. I played sports well past most people my age, but then a bout of injuries came when I tried to ramp up to a half-marathon. Injuries to my feet, knees, ankles, lower back, etc all came suddenly and were interconnected. All my weak postural-, flexibility-, and mechanics- issues became problematic. Now I tend to walk like Zion when I'm stiff, and must increase the exercise and rehab regimen much more slowly to avoid injuries.
I really thought this was the year for the pels. Gotta feel bad for them. This season started with the lakers stinking which made their draft pick way more valuable even if they were never quite bad enough to make wemby a real possibility and zion was on a hot streak with them as the second or third seed. I hope they can recover and come back in full force next year
The worst part is when they were healthy they were so much fun. One of those teams that just makes you sit back and appreciate basketball and just a blast to see them running the floor even as a neutral fan. It really sucks to see them get derailed like this with injuries
This sucks. The Pels and their fans were so much fun last year even without Zion. When they had him at the beginning of the year they were terrifying and electric. Watching a generational player get sidelined with injuries before they even get started is such a fucking bummer.
Is there any chance he has a Joel Embiid type of career where he overcomes the early injury history? Or is this just going to be his career from here on it?
I don't consider injury players busts either but Grant Hill and Derrick Rose had far more to their careers. Hill and Rose had 4-5 years of excellent careers before one particular injury sent them on a spiral. This seems more like a Greg Oden situation (although Zion is currently better than Oden ever showed), flashes of greatness were shown but never healthy enough to show them consistently for a full season
Grant Hill is in the Hall of Fame. Maybe he didn't do as many high-flying highlight dunks after his injuries, but still had a fantastic career. Should not be talked about in the 'what if' category at all.
> Grant Hill’s college career also greatly improved his HoF resume.
It did, but his nba resume alone is as-good/better than Mitch Richmond who is also in the HoF
Hill:
* 5x all-nba (1x first team, 4x second team)
* 7x all-star
Richmond:
* 5x all-nba (0x first team, 3x second team, 2x third team )
* 6x all-star
Mitch hitting 20k points really helped his odds, but Grant was clearly the better NBA player
Hill is in the Penny Hardaway category. He had a good career even with the injuries, but could have been all-time if he hadn't been derailed.
Edit: Hard to remember now, but Hill was "Next face of the league" big. Just a mega-star.
Putting a guy like Grant Hill in the what if category is a huge compliment imo. Despite failing to live up to expectations (largely for injury reasons) he was still a Hall of Famer.
I still have him as a what if, because he was (imo) really on a higher end trajectory, seen by many as a possible "next Michael Jordan" level player. But I get what you mean. Not saying he had a bad career, just saying he didn't reach the heights he could have, due to injuries.
It's still too early. The truth is if Zion could play 60+ games, he'd be a MVP candidate. The dude is straight up unlike anything I've seen on a basketball court. If he has another year or two like this , I think the conversation gets more and more interesting for sure, but it's still too early. His second contract hasn't even kicked in yet.
Gotta say though, the energy on this team died when he went out. Last year we were so fun to watch near the end and played with tons of heart. This year, the team is almost unbearable to watch, they legit look like they don't give shit about fuck.
We’ve literally never seen a player of his caliber play this few games to start a career due to multiple injuries. I echo your sentiment in saying that it’s far too early to say he’s a bust. Disappointing? Maybe. But definitely not a bust.
Right now he's in the Greg Oden category. If he gets it together for a few years he'll be in the Brandon Roy category. If he comes back and whirlwinds a title in NOLA then his body goes to jelly, he'll be in the Bill Walton category.
Yes Blazer fans have layers and categories of pain.
I'm happy to see the Greg Oden comps in here in the sense that I feel like a lot of people just hear Oden and think "that guy was a bum, cant believe they didnt take Durant", when in reality his talent merited the selection and injuries just fucked him, which is exactly what is happening with Zion (unfortunately)
Zion I don’t think will play again. This report seems leaked so when they shut him down it’s not really a surprise to people.
Kat honestly is one of the weirder ones. When it first happened I thought it was Achilles. Non contact and he immediately looked back. Then it came out as grade 3 calf strain and he didn’t get surgery? I honestly don’t know how serious it is/isn’t or any progress. He could be out for the year or play in a week and both wouldn’t surprise me
That injury looked really bad at the time (non-contact, running, looks behind him to see if he was kicked) and the organization said it wasn't that serious almost immediately. I'm pretty sure they're downplaying how bad it really was.
So bizarre when front office seems to be so secretive with injuries. If they said back in November he would be out for months, people would've been sad, but at least moved on.
Realistically, I think this Lakers team can secure their position in the play-in. Would be a crazy performance if they make it to the top 6 seed. Lebron should be available by then
I don’t think you can call him a bust. He’s lived up to his hype with his play on the court (27/7/4 on 65 Ts% in last 2 seasons played), but his body is failing him. Embiid missed his first 2 years, over 50 games his rookie year, and hasn’t ever played over 70 games in a season. But he’s still an MVP caliber player and really dominant when he’s on the court.
Zion’s still just 22, so he has time to put it together. He clearly put in a shit ton of work, to lose a lot of weight and drop a lot of body fat this season. He may just be an Embiid or Kawhi type player, where he inevitably misses a lot of time due to injuries, but is incredibly impactful and an elite player when actually playing.
I really like Zion and I hope he can prove the doubters wrong one day. Hoping he stays healthy.
> Zion’s still just 22, so he has time to put it together.
Brandon Roy & Greg Oden only played about 6 seasons. Idk but it isn't looking good for Zion at this rate.
I’m not exactly saying he’s a bust but the best ability is availability. Using the #1 overall pick on someone who plays less than 50% of the time isn’t exactly a great pick. When he’s on the court he absolutely shows why he was the #1 pick but that isn’t very often
This shit sucks. NOLA was looking so good with him and down right scary with Ingram coming back. He needs to reach out to that old Phoenix Medical Staff that was keeping the 7SOL Suns healthy. Those people were miracle workers
Is Zion Williamson actually a Grizzly Bear that requires hibernation?
Zion and Ja teaming up in Memphis to never play a game together, incoming.
I knew the “best ability is availability” takes from our camp would backfire…but not quite like this lol.
Atleast its the only thing that backfired....
So what you're saying is, RJ Barrett was the best top 3 pick in that draft? :') Say it
I'd still cripple zion and crip Ja over him
Over RJ Barreta?
Who will it be next season? Zion Williamson? Zioff Hibernation?
Jesus Christ this is horrendous. He's averaging under 30 GP per season so far ...
27 PPG on 65 TS% over his last 2 seasons too :( Straight up one of the best scorers in the league by his season 2nd season and we’re probably never gonna get to see his career actualized
I 100% get why New Orleans extended Zion, but holy hell that thing already looks like it's more likely than not to be an awful deal. From the 23-24 to 27-28 seasons, they are scheduled to pay Zion around 200 million. He's electric when he plays, but at this stage, I have no idea how you can count on Zion to even average 41 games a year.
Forget the regular season. Even if they load manage him like crazy what are they gonna do in the playoffs where starters play extremely heavy minutes very often with little to no rest between games
No way NOLA makes the playoffs, they are 3-7 in their last 10, and in a 3 way tie for 10th now. Both Thunder and Blazers are playing better, they'll finish ahead of NOLA. The irony is that all season fans were laughing about getting the Lakers pick (via swap), but now NOLA is going to finsh with a worse record.
I agree that it's likely they fall out, but they can still get in. They have the fourth-easiest schedule left for the remainder of the season. They have a stretch of consecutive games coming up against Houston (2x), San Antonio, and Charlotte. They are a much better home team than road team, and four of their last five are at home. Josh Richardson just got back and I think Nance and Alvarado will return for the home stretch. Portland and OKC are both 4-6 in their last 10 so it's not like they're setting the world on fire, either. NOLA is in a bad spot, but they were last year, too, before winning 5 of their last 6.
Mans brought receipts!
It’s an off day!
Every day should be, brotha! The days you're working, making cheese to feed your needs, them days shouldn't make you want to disappear either
NOLA fans totally jinxed themselves celebrating being 1st seed and having the first pick (from Lakers) 20 games into the season lmao
It's crazy how we seem to tell fans every yr it's only been 20 games calm down whether it's a bad team getting off to a good start or a good team starting slow. The 1st 20 games can be weird as shit sometimes
Spurs were top 5 for a short period. About the only consistent teams were the Nuggets and Celtics.
Houston has been extremely consistent this season
The Jazz were crazy in the first 25 games
Nonsense. Warriors have been consistently horrible on the road, great at home, and mediocre on average. Consistency!
Hello? The Cavs have been consistently in the top 4 the whole season.
Nvm bucks lol
How could we not celebrate? We don’t get that chance very often
better to have loved and lost than to have never loved at all
Half this sub was saying that, not just NOP fans
Apparently they had a 'Wembenyama game thread' every time the Lakers played, at least early on when the Lakers were slumping in that 2-10 start.
You get him on a diet and have him drop 30/40 pounds. He may lose some of that strength, but I bet he even gains some of that explosiveness he had at Duke back, and I’m sure the injury concerns would be significantly reduced. It worked for Barkley back in the day, who was a similar size and player. His style of play at his height and weight is just not sustainable for the human body. We had this fear before he entered the league, and it’s proven to be warranted. Gotta get the weight down and hope for the best.
KP focused on losing weight/prioritizing strength in the offseason after trying to bulk up in Dallas, and he's managed to play 55 games so far (inshallah he shall remain healthy). It's a legit strategy for longevity.
Yeah, idk if that was Dallas’ or KP’s call but it was a bad one. New York KP looked like a prime Dirk clone! Lanky, but very fluid and quick. Then he gets to Dallas and looks like Ivan Drago. Problem is, he moved like him too. Super stiff, not coordinated, and not explosive at all on the offensive end. Glad he’s seen some success with y’all!
Funny enough, I remember Chandler Parsons bragging about how much muscle he was packing on and Carlisle saying he should not do that because he’s going to hurt himself. And we all know how that went. Dudes gotta be very careful with the muscle they add on with how much running and jumping they have to do.
I’m no pro but it’s funny how I just went through the same thing. Got back into organized ball and was in the gym heavily and in the best shape of my life. But of course managed to pick up so many minor injuries and I thought it was me just getting older and breaking down. But I just had to cut back on the heavy lifting and focus on my fitness and my functional strength. Don’t look nearly as jacked which was a bummer at first, but feel better than ever when hooping which more than makes up for it
I started specializing in Olympic weightlifting after decades as a basketball then volleyball player. I think I broke my knees the first volleyball game back after 3-4 years of weightlifting.
Are we sure that this is why he has remained healthy or is it the beard. He never tried growing a beard in Dallas.
I've always said if he'd lose 50lbs he'd float like Jordan
Wasnt there some health stipulations in the contract? Thought they embiid’d it
Sucks. I really enjoy watching him play.
I dunno man, at some point the team is probably gonna have to address his weight. It seems like the whole issue has been handled with kid gloves since he entered the league. Like yeah, he lost weight but let's be honest he was still pretty big (evaluating by elite professional athlete standards of course). Like I get that it's a tough conversation to have, especially in America it seems, but it seems pretty obvious to me that it is effecting his longevity, especially given his extremely physical/athletic play-style.
I wanted to be wrong about this guy, but I had a feeling his career would go about like it has.
Same. Hard not to see it coming. Very disappointing as a fan of the sport. I will say I did not foresee Ja’s current issues at all. Thought he was the safer pick of the two, but we’ll see how that goes.
Jonathan Isaac was the 6th pick in 2017, and Zion was the 1st pick in 2019. They've played 261 games combined. Grant Williams was the 22nd pick in 2019 and he's played 273 games, not including playoffs
Yea but he’s literally Mr Potatohead..
If bro gets injured, they just rip off the injured limb and replace it with a shiny new one. Talk about an unfair advantage smh
There were so many people, myself included, that saw this coming all the way back before he was even drafted. The guy is like 300 pounds and beats in his body like Derrick Rose. There's just no way he holds up.
When the Cavs clinch a spot, picks 2-5 of the 2019 draft will have played in the playoffs before Zion
Picks 2-11 actually
damn PJ washington
We're trying our best okay
I'm trying Jennifer
bust alert
Moses Moody has already played more NBA games (incl. playoffs) than Zion and he was picked in 2021.
And he's getting DNP'd in favor of Anthony freaking lamb of all people
why does Anthony Lamb always look like he knows he's an imposter on the court?
He knows he should be playing in a prison league
Wow, just read about that. What a piece of fucking garbage.
Because he knows he should be in jail for rape
Having been in Portland during the Greg Oden years, I feel for the the Pelican fans right now
I read that in his entire life Zion has not played more than 25 consecutive games, at any level. If true, that’s nuts.
The human body wasn’t build to move in the way he does and take that type of stress at his size.
Only makes LeBron’s durability that much more impressive, especially in his younger days. He’s the only athletic equivalent I can think of.
LeBron also doesn’t try to play while being a good 30-50 lbs overweight though. His joints are going to age a lot better than Zion who is on track to have old man knees by the time he’s 35 if he doesn’t improve his conditioning
No chance Zion's in the league at 35
35? i don’t think he will make 30.
What is he 22 now? Wouldn't be surprised if he washes out of the league before his early prime if he doesn't get his weight under control.
i see a lot of Bron's workouts also involve a lot of resistance and stability training on top of the usual strength routines. i think that plays a huge part in it as well. incorporating those into your regimen is important no matter how light or heavy you are, but especially for athletes because their joints take a lot of pounding.
The way Zion plays the first person I thought of was DRose if he was heavier and taller. There was no way I thought Zion would be healthy after seeing DRose fall apart. Being top heavy like that just accelerated whatever issues he has in his posterior chain.
As someone with a team that could hit the lottery this year, Wemby is starting to scare me as a #1 pick.
Drafting Wemby at #1 is a have-to situation. I would rather my team be clowned for drafting Wemby and dealing with his injuries than passing on him in some Sam Bowie-type scenario.
True, and if the Spurs get #1 I have no doubt they'd have to take him, too. Though Scoot or even an underheralded player could end up being the best player this class, you just never know.
While it is scary, they have to draft him. One bright side is Wemby hasn’t gone through the AAU system and (as far as I’m aware) doesn’t have the wear and tear on his body that a lot of American prospects currently have.
Imagine a world where him and Morant aren’t in the league early on for two different reasons
The teams on the Mississippi River are cursed. This is including KAT.
St. Louis dodged a bullet by not getting a team apparently
They’re still cursed because their team left them for Atlanta
Cursed by birth.
The Spirits of St. Louis got a massive perpetual bag from not getting into the league.
Yeah but is St. Louis. So they’re probably still dodging bullets.
I moved to STL this year. Can confirm
that video of the guy clearing his jam before shooting that poor man again. i was like well that's probably off the beaten path. no, i scooted past that place on my way to city museum a few years back. i was only in stl for 2 days but i liked it.
i scooted lol
I'll have you know I only dodged two into work today! granted, I do work in my garage, but still only 2!
I always knew Mississippi river was big, but it starts from Minnesota???
4th longest river in the world.
The Mississippi-Missouri is, not just the Misssissippi. Important distinction as that branch (although named differently) goes all the way to Montana and not Minnesota
This guy deltas.
it's wild because the Missouri River is actually longer even though the Missouri is a tributary of the Mississippi
one of its tributaries even comes from west Montana! it's crazy
The Mississippi watershed spans roughly 1/3 of the total land area of the continental U.S. This river was a huge part of the U.S.’s economic success, especially before planes. New Orleans was like the 4th biggest city in the country around 1900 in part because the Mississippi port was so important
Also a big reason why St Louis was “The Gateway to the West” because it was near the confluence of the Mississippi and Missouri rivers with the Illinois River not too far from it. St Louis was also Top 5 and even held an Olympics in 1904.
Yes, the Twin cities are right along it.
Yep, the headwaters are located in Itasca State park, about a 4 hour drive north of the cities, up there the river is about 3 and half feet deep and like 12 feet across. It's a Minnesotan's right of passage to walk across the [rocks](https://img.apmcdn.org/7e09ea30950afb473c021b676e196bd15a54c09b/uncropped/591325-20200904-itasca-state-park06.jpg). It takes 90 days from the water there to reach the Gulf of Mexico
As a Knicks fan who's never been crazy about RJ, I have to admit that at least he's available to play.
He seems to have found a nice lane as the 3rd option. They were leaning on him way to hard early in his career
If he could get his defense back to where it was last season I'd be happy with it this season though it's been a step back for him for whatever reasons. last season he looked like he was going to become an above average defender at the moment though absolutely nobody is scared of RJ guarding him and will shoot over him all day and catch him on any number of screens
I mean recently his defense has been pretty good! Did well in Boston vs Tatum and Brown, yesterday he was cooking the hornets early
Losing their job because they either love guns too much or is at an unhealthy weight. Murica
Are these weight related or freak accidents
Hamstring injury is a bitch, fat or not.
I think the fact that he's so explosive for his size that his body just can't handle it on a night to night basis in the NBA.
Is he deku or some shit what
We don't got a nurse that can kiss em injuries away.
Need to have Eri constantly attached to Zion so he can go all out, while his legs heal in real time lmfao
I wonder if his jumper/release gets affected by eri tbh. Kinda like how Draymond looks like as if has a bag on him. Lmao,I am imagining mha characters as attachments to nba players now.
Nothing in the rulebook says that you can't strap an 8 year old girl with super-healing powers to your back.
Danuel House has entered the chat
New Orleans Smash?
For all we know, he already says that when he gets a windmill or 360 dunk
I think he would appreciate that reference.
wow this is actually super accurate haha, All Might has been trying to get him to chill but it's not working
All he needs is a support item from Melissa Shield
You see this a lot with WRs in football for basically the same reason. They're just too explosive. The human body isn't really meant to do a lot of these things.
Zion has a whole biomechanical imbalance. You can see this just by his gait (the way he walks). Poor mechanics means your body won’t be able to dissipate forces on the body well and his added weight (increased weight + gravity = more force) is only going to contribute to added stress that’s going be placed on his body. It sucks because he’s such a freak of nature but I don’t think he has any real longevity in this league. We’re going to look back one day and think “damn that dude Zion could’ve been one of the all time greats if he could have sustained himself”.
I thought that they tried to fix his biomechanics in his first year in the NBA.
That’s what I heard but promoting more efficient biomechanics is a lot harder than simply just rehabbing a muscle strain or fracture because it has a great deal to do with a person’s alignment, posture, and motor control. How Zion’s moving at the moment is most likely how he’s been moving his whole life so it doesn’t just happen within a few days or weeks. He needs a really good rehab specialist and his own ability to learn/retain these new motor patterns is a huge variable.
Yup. I’m relearning how to walk properly after a host of different foot related issues. Two years and countless PT hours later, I’m probably only halfway there. Granted I’m not working with world class trainers and therapists around the clock, but still, my PT is one of the best in the SF Bay Area and I’m focused on this to prevent further issues and complications down the road. There’s just so many complicating factors all you can really do is continue to go at it and hope for the best.
Good luck brother. Just know that you can do a lot more than you think you can when you put mind into it. Keep at it!!💪
Appreciate it. It isn’t anything horrible, and if you saw me walking on the street, you wouldn’t even be able to tell. I was just trying to figure out why I kept rolling my ankle.
The same thing happened with Andrew Bynum
Lakers were #1 seed right before Bynum got hurt and before the Gasol trade. A huge part of that was how good Bynum was at 20 years old. Bynum was a legit beast before his injury and probably well on his way to being the second or third best center in the league after Dwight and Yao. As a Lakers fan, I will never forget the 08 season for many reasons. Expectations were #7 seed again but ended up as #1 seed. Bynum looking like a star. Return of Fisher. Kobe MVP season. Bynum got hurt. Gasol Trade. Getting to the Finals. And then I forgot what happened after that.
>before Bynum got hurt Yeah that’s the point I’m making. He was always hurt because of a combination of the way his legs were oriented and his height/weight
His injury in 2008 was because Lamar Odom landed on his knee.
He was already the second or third best center in the league at that point imho. Mostly because they weren't many great centers in the league during those years but still
Andrew Bynum had two knee surgies before coming to the NBA. If had to go to college, he would have never made the league.
Combination of both. Would be funny if he lost weight and we come to find out his size limiting his explosion was also keeping him healthy
He has very bad body mechanics. By that I mean, look how he walks. He is walking like a penguin. Remember when he was first out, you got news like zion needs to learn how to walk. He is very muscle bound + the weight, he is a walking injury. Unless he loses weight and works on his body mechanics, adds flexibility to his joints he will never play a whole season. His work ethic is also not the best, I just don't see it.
He walks like he has no knees to bend lol
He walks like Cotton Hill
Weighing more increasing your % chance of getting injured and makes recovery longer
Hard to say if it doesn’t have an effect on him due to being overweight, but it could just be that he has poor flexibility, muscle imbalances, bad posture, or a weak core. I’m 29, 6’1 175 and I consider myself in pretty good shape (still play sports and workout a lot). But I’ve been plagued by hamstring issues since I was 21. Pelicans should get him in some kinda offseason yoga program to help with soft tissue injuries.
As an older dude, I'd say you're right on. I played sports well past most people my age, but then a bout of injuries came when I tried to ramp up to a half-marathon. Injuries to my feet, knees, ankles, lower back, etc all came suddenly and were interconnected. All my weak postural-, flexibility-, and mechanics- issues became problematic. Now I tend to walk like Zion when I'm stiff, and must increase the exercise and rehab regimen much more slowly to avoid injuries.
Weight + how he plays = obvious this would happen. Since Duke this has been the main topic when talking about Zion
I really thought this was the year for the pels. Gotta feel bad for them. This season started with the lakers stinking which made their draft pick way more valuable even if they were never quite bad enough to make wemby a real possibility and zion was on a hot streak with them as the second or third seed. I hope they can recover and come back in full force next year
The worst part is when they were healthy they were so much fun. One of those teams that just makes you sit back and appreciate basketball and just a blast to see them running the floor even as a neutral fan. It really sucks to see them get derailed like this with injuries
Zion “ the real street clothes” Williamson
The true heir to Day-to-Davis. They went from one injury prone star to another
One very injury prone generational talent to another, but AD wasn’t this injury prone at the pels
I think his current weight is giving problems. Back when he was in NOLA he was a lot skinnier.
Zion really is year to year
AD still managed to average like 60+ games a season for pelican which is still double the amount of average zion play a season rn
AD wasn't missing months of time with the Pelicans.
That’s why AD is day to day. Zion is year to year
AD wasn’t nearly this susceptible to injury
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EBBiUynUYAAT0Sc.jpg
Zion Week-to-Weekson in full force.
Zion WilliamSoon^^TM
Zioff
Zion Will-he-play-or-not-again-soon
Zion Will-come-back-next-sea-son
Zion Will-He-Slim-Down-Some
This sucks. The Pels and their fans were so much fun last year even without Zion. When they had him at the beginning of the year they were terrifying and electric. Watching a generational player get sidelined with injuries before they even get started is such a fucking bummer. Is there any chance he has a Joel Embiid type of career where he overcomes the early injury history? Or is this just going to be his career from here on it?
Not a bust, I'm just putting him in that Grant Hill/Derrick Rose "what if" category for now. Injuries suck :/
I don't consider injury players busts either but Grant Hill and Derrick Rose had far more to their careers. Hill and Rose had 4-5 years of excellent careers before one particular injury sent them on a spiral. This seems more like a Greg Oden situation (although Zion is currently better than Oden ever showed), flashes of greatness were shown but never healthy enough to show them consistently for a full season
Grant Hill is in the Hall of Fame. Maybe he didn't do as many high-flying highlight dunks after his injuries, but still had a fantastic career. Should not be talked about in the 'what if' category at all.
Grant Hill's college career also greatly improved his HoF resume.
> Grant Hill’s college career also greatly improved his HoF resume. It did, but his nba resume alone is as-good/better than Mitch Richmond who is also in the HoF Hill: * 5x all-nba (1x first team, 4x second team) * 7x all-star Richmond: * 5x all-nba (0x first team, 3x second team, 2x third team ) * 6x all-star Mitch hitting 20k points really helped his odds, but Grant was clearly the better NBA player
Hill is in the Penny Hardaway category. He had a good career even with the injuries, but could have been all-time if he hadn't been derailed. Edit: Hard to remember now, but Hill was "Next face of the league" big. Just a mega-star.
Putting a guy like Grant Hill in the what if category is a huge compliment imo. Despite failing to live up to expectations (largely for injury reasons) he was still a Hall of Famer.
Yeah I’d put Brandon Roy in there instead
I still have him as a what if, because he was (imo) really on a higher end trajectory, seen by many as a possible "next Michael Jordan" level player. But I get what you mean. Not saying he had a bad career, just saying he didn't reach the heights he could have, due to injuries.
So a hall of famer and a league MVP type of bust..?
It's still too early. The truth is if Zion could play 60+ games, he'd be a MVP candidate. The dude is straight up unlike anything I've seen on a basketball court. If he has another year or two like this , I think the conversation gets more and more interesting for sure, but it's still too early. His second contract hasn't even kicked in yet. Gotta say though, the energy on this team died when he went out. Last year we were so fun to watch near the end and played with tons of heart. This year, the team is almost unbearable to watch, they legit look like they don't give shit about fuck.
Sure it's too early to say he's a bust but if I were the Pelicans I'd be really worried
We’ve literally never seen a player of his caliber play this few games to start a career due to multiple injuries. I echo your sentiment in saying that it’s far too early to say he’s a bust. Disappointing? Maybe. But definitely not a bust.
Joel Embiid?
Nah Embiid wasn't this good at this point of his career. 2021 Zion or this season's Zion was definitely better than year 4 Embiid.
Embiid? He missed 2 full seasons and then played \~30 games in his 3rd year to start his career.
Right now he's in the Greg Oden category. If he gets it together for a few years he'll be in the Brandon Roy category. If he comes back and whirlwinds a title in NOLA then his body goes to jelly, he'll be in the Bill Walton category. Yes Blazer fans have layers and categories of pain.
Couldn't have worked Sam Bowie into this somewhere? 🤣🤙🏻
Ja would have to become MJ
I'm happy to see the Greg Oden comps in here in the sense that I feel like a lot of people just hear Oden and think "that guy was a bum, cant believe they didnt take Durant", when in reality his talent merited the selection and injuries just fucked him, which is exactly what is happening with Zion (unfortunately)
I’m gonna go out on a limb and say LeBron Zion and KAT are done for the year
I’d wager Lebron will play again if Lakers make the play ins
Yeah it’s very possible. He’s probably the most likely to come back of the three
Zion I don’t think will play again. This report seems leaked so when they shut him down it’s not really a surprise to people. Kat honestly is one of the weirder ones. When it first happened I thought it was Achilles. Non contact and he immediately looked back. Then it came out as grade 3 calf strain and he didn’t get surgery? I honestly don’t know how serious it is/isn’t or any progress. He could be out for the year or play in a week and both wouldn’t surprise me
I think they’ll make it. Someone is going to fall off, and it could be the pelicans.
What even happened to Kat? I just realized he's missed most of the season at this point.
Never ending calf injury apparently
I’m more inclined to believe that KAT tore his calf tbh.
I'm starting to believe he never had calves to begin with and people were starting to catch on
KAT has been Cotton Hill this whole time, and we just never noticed.
That injury looked really bad at the time (non-contact, running, looks behind him to see if he was kicked) and the organization said it wasn't that serious almost immediately. I'm pretty sure they're downplaying how bad it really was.
That's what a grade 3 calf strain is. Which is something I just found out a few days ago. the word strain really masks the severity of the incident.
He literally did. Grade 3 calf strain is a full tear
So bizarre when front office seems to be so secretive with injuries. If they said back in November he would be out for months, people would've been sad, but at least moved on.
Lebron 100% plays in the playoffs if the lakers make it. As it stands his timetable puts him at game ready a week or so before playoffs to begin with
Realistically, I think this Lakers team can secure their position in the play-in. Would be a crazy performance if they make it to the top 6 seed. Lebron should be available by then
I would have agreed on Kat, but Finch said he's back in "live actions" at practice today so there's some hope at least (though I'm still skeptical)
I don’t think you can call him a bust. He’s lived up to his hype with his play on the court (27/7/4 on 65 Ts% in last 2 seasons played), but his body is failing him. Embiid missed his first 2 years, over 50 games his rookie year, and hasn’t ever played over 70 games in a season. But he’s still an MVP caliber player and really dominant when he’s on the court. Zion’s still just 22, so he has time to put it together. He clearly put in a shit ton of work, to lose a lot of weight and drop a lot of body fat this season. He may just be an Embiid or Kawhi type player, where he inevitably misses a lot of time due to injuries, but is incredibly impactful and an elite player when actually playing. I really like Zion and I hope he can prove the doubters wrong one day. Hoping he stays healthy.
He's gonna be a Greg Oden / Brandon Roy what-if, not a Anthony Bennett / Kwame Brown this dude can't ball kind of bust.
> Zion’s still just 22, so he has time to put it together. Brandon Roy & Greg Oden only played about 6 seasons. Idk but it isn't looking good for Zion at this rate.
I’m not exactly saying he’s a bust but the best ability is availability. Using the #1 overall pick on someone who plays less than 50% of the time isn’t exactly a great pick. When he’s on the court he absolutely shows why he was the #1 pick but that isn’t very often
Embiid played 94 games in his first four seasons compared to Zion’s 114. Injuries are not comparable situations—but I like to have a little faith.
This shit sucks. NOLA was looking so good with him and down right scary with Ingram coming back. He needs to reach out to that old Phoenix Medical Staff that was keeping the 7SOL Suns healthy. Those people were miracle workers
You might be referring to Aaron Nelson ...who moved to the Pels org in 2019. Kill me.
Zion williamsoon
Embiid played 94 games in his first 4 seasons in the league. Zion has played 114 games. It's too early.
There’s many people that had injury history that we call busts. Zion shouldn’t be an exception